Ep 39. The Stern Truth: Business Tips, the Ted Lasso Way!

Today's episode is completely different from our regularly scheduled podcast. Recently, I had the pleasure of being a guest on the Coala Studio Podcast with Rounak Sardesai.

Rounak and I talked about all things small business and entrepreneurial growth, the “Ted Lasso” way. I liken myself to Ted Lasso because his coaching philosophies are always true golden nuggets.I do encourage you to Google Ted Lasso before this episode to understand the reference. Even if you don’t, you’ll understand what I’m getting at.

I talk with Rounak about one of my earliest entrepreneurial ventures (and failures), my environmental t-shirt business. I also share valuable lessons I’ve learned through the years, like how my first employee taught me to stay in my lane as the leader and how my sign company survived years of bumps in the road.

Business owners are strong, and what makes them their strongest is a leadership mindset, belief in themselves and their team, and taking consistent action. Two more golden nuggets I share: don’t ignore your business numbers, and, something I always drive home, surround yourself with the right people.

This was a special experience for me because I got to share my story, my own highs and lows of entrepreneurship. Thank you again to Rounak and to Coala Studios for having me!

The ONtrepreneur Growth Academy starts October 8th. Interested in attending? Email me at marshall@marshallstern.net.

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I encourage you to reach out with feedback, topic suggestions, and share your own entrepreneurial challenges.

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Transcript

[00:00:00] Marshall Stern: All right everyone, so today's episode is completely different. You're going to find out in just a second what I mean by that. But I have a question for you. What if Ted Lasso could coach you in your business? What do you think he would say? What kind of business tips and strategies do you think Ted Lasso, you know, the Lasso way?

[00:00:20] If you're not sure who Ted Lasso is, not sure where you've been, maybe just Google it before you. Listen to this episode. Actually, forget Googling it. Listen or watch this episode. I am actually interviewed. I'm actually featured on another podcast. This is what you're going to be hearing in a second, and it is with amazing Rounak Sardesai of Coala Studios.

[00:00:39] I'm telling you, yes, I'm being interviewed and I share some golden nuggets, absolutely. But the interaction with Rounak is incredible and I think you need to grab a big, like what is the 11 the legal size pad of paper because there's tons I'm going to be sharing with you today on business tips, the Ted Lasso way.

[00:00:59] Enough about that. Grab the pad of paper, the big one, and enjoy this episode.

[00:01:09] Hi, I'm Marshall Stern and I've spent over 35 years leading and growing multiple small businesses. I know firsthand the struggles of entrepreneurship, feeling isolated, lonely, overwhelmed, and feeling like you have to do it all by yourself. I've been through multiple recessions, and I have felt the highs and the lows.

[00:01:28] I've been there, and I get it. This podcast is here to change that every week. I will bring you straight talking advice, real world strategies, and honest conversations about what it takes to succeed in business without the fluff, the gimmicks, or the sugar-coated. If you're ready to stop spinning your wheels and start making real progress, then you are in the right place. 

[00:01:52] This is the Stern Truth. 

[00:01:56] Rounak Sardesai: Marshall, thank you so much for being here. We're so excited to have a conversation with you today on the podcast. To start off, do you want to give us an elevator pitch of what's been going on, who you are? Let our audience know all of the good stuff. 

[00:02:12] Marshall Stern: So first off, it's awesome being here.

[00:02:14] I've been looking forward to this. Regarding the elevator pitch, I don't like elevator pitches. However, so for your audience, I'll have a question for the audience. Are they familiar with Ted Lasso? 

[00:02:28] Rounak Sardesai: I am hoping so. I am. 

[00:02:31] Marshall Stern: You are. So I would say I – I don't like the elevator pitch because I want it to become natural when I'm, when I meet people, I work with small business owners and entrepreneurs, and I'm like the Ted lasso for them.

[00:02:41] So I help them believe more in themselves. I used to be in BNI, and I used to stand up every week, and I used to say I help small business owners and entrepreneurs build a business that works so they don't have to, although that is somewhat true. Anyways, it's a little bit scripted and not natural. 

[00:03:02] Rounak Sardesai: And difficult to follow through on because the entrepreneur plays a huge role in making things happen 

[00:03:10] Marshall Stern: 110%.

[00:03:12] Rounak Sardesai: So you're like Ted Lasso before Ted Lasso? 

[00:03:15] Marshall Stern: Yes. 

[00:03:16] Rounak Sardesai: Wow. So the idea of today's podcast is basically we want to have a conversation about business, about the people you deal with, the entrepreneurs that you, you meet with, chat with every day, and I want to kind of understand what it is that is a common factor in maybe, you know, entrepreneurs falling short of their potential.

[00:03:39] What's one of the traits in entrepreneurs that you work with that's a necessity, in your opinion, for any sort of success, long or short term? 

[00:03:49] Marshall Stern: I'm going to go back to the Ted Lasso reference. I think, and I know this from over – I'm aging myself here – over 35 years. It's actually much more than that, but not much more in running multiple businesses, small business owners far, far too often being the player and not the coach.

[00:04:06] And what I mean by that is they end up having that employee mindset and they get stuck in the business focusing on all the daily activities, the admin, the invoicing, the client work, everything, and not enough on the business working. Too much in, not on. If your audience, if your listeners, viewers, could take one thing from this, I don't care where you're at in your business, what stage you're at in your business, you could be brand new plan for becoming more of the coach, plan for being, becoming more of the leader.

[00:04:42] And that's what I mean by coach, right? Leading your business, having the vision, building a team around you. It might not be right away. Don't get stuck being the employee. 

[00:04:51] Rounak Sardesai: This is a great point and it's been brought up in so many different podcasts and as a business owner myself, I feel like this is possible or it gets easier after a certain stage in your business, but I know that a lot of our listeners are just starting out, or they're solopreneurs, and how do you reckon someone who's a solopreneur do this more efficiently? And focus more on working on the business as opposed to working in the business. 

[00:05:22] Marshall Stern: I would just turn it around and just like put the lens on you, like, look at what you've done.

[00:05:28] Right. Build a team. Here's what I see a problem, especially since the pandemic. So many people, let's say we're digital marketers. They worked for X, Y, Z corporation. 

[00:05:37] Rounak Sardesai: Yeah. 

[00:05:38] Marshall Stern: They were COVID-ed out of a job or they had a come to Jesus moment, and it's like, I'm leaving, I'm starting my own business. I'm going to be a digital marketer on my own.

[00:05:45] And what happens is they're an employee in their own business. Why do people, why did you start your own business? 

[00:05:53] Rounak Sardesai: I've always wanted to do it since I was eight, I think. Eight or 10. 

[00:05:57] Marshall Stern: Why not work for- 

[00:05:58] Rounak Sardesai: I'm a huge fan of Monopoly. 

[00:05:59] Marshall Stern: Why not work for someone else? 

[00:06:00] Rounak Sardesai: I did work for quite a bit, and I don't know, it just seemed like the, right? But buying your time back or having the freedom to do things that you want to do when you want to do them, I guess. At least to a certain extent. 

[00:06:16] Marshall Stern: Well, and that's the problem. A lot of people do that and then they have less freedom. They're working for less money. 

[00:06:22] Rounak Sardesai: Oh, absolutely. 

[00:06:23] Marshall Stern: Right. And at the beginning I get it.

[00:06:24] So if you're just starting out, just know that it's, as they say, it takes a village. So whether you – you don't have to have employees right away. You can work with, you can just build your team of subcontractors. Just bring people into your inner circle, 

[00:06:41] Rounak Sardesai: Right.

[00:06:42] Marshall Stern: Coaches, mentors, accountability partners, other entrepreneurs go to networking events that have other entrepreneurs that just want to support each other.

[00:06:50] Keep the eye on the bigger vision. If it's freedom is why you started, make sure that you never lose that. I'm all about the why and the what. 

[00:06:58] Rounak Sardesai: Right, 

[00:06:58] Marshall Stern: As you know. So really get clear of why you're doing your business and don't forget it. 

[00:07:02] Rounak Sardesai: What are the top three reasons that other entrepreneurs have chosen to get into entrepreneurship?

[00:07:07] Marshall Stern: Well, first of all, entrepreneurs – so there's a difference. Not all small business owners or business owners are entrepreneurs. Not all entrepreneurs are business owners. 

[00:07:14] Rounak Sardesai: Okay. Why don't we start with the definition of that? What is the difference? 

[00:07:19] Marshall Stern: I think we all know what a small business owner is, or a business owner. You own a business, you could own a, and I'm not downplaying this. You could be a candle maker. 

[00:07:30] Rounak Sardesai: Yeah. 

[00:07:31] Marshall Stern: Yeah, right. It could be a hobby or it could be a real legitimate, full-time business and you're making all these candles and you're selling them. There are a lot of employees who are entrepreneurial, who are entrepreneurs, and eventually they will probably end up doing something on their own.

[00:07:44] Rounak Sardesai: Right. 

[00:07:44] Marshall Stern: But they're not a business owner. The entrepreneur is someone who is thinking about business, thinking about the vision, constantly wanting to build. Real true entrepreneurs don't usually stay in business too long, honestly. They start a business, they build it, they sell it, they move on to something else, they get bored.

[00:08:01] Rounak Sardesai: Right, 

[00:08:02] Marshall Stern: Right. It's what like the entrepreneurial ADD. Aas a business owner, small, medium, large, maybe a little bit different. You do have to have an entrepreneurial spirit, but you need to harness it to a certain point. If you get bored too quickly, you might give up too quickly or move on too quickly. So really it's getting clear on, so I talked about the why, getting clear on, I call the what, and that's the vision, right?

[00:08:26] What do you really want to build? What do you want to create? Do you want to become the number one digital marketing agency in North America or Canada, or the world? The monopoly. Do you want to become the Amazon of digital marketing? 

[00:08:40] Rounak Sardesai: What are the three most common reasons that you hear from people in business wanting to start a business? 

[00:08:46] Marshall Stern: Number one is always freedom. 

[00:08:48] Rounak Sardesai: Right. 

[00:08:49] Marshall Stern: Okay. Part of freedom. They're just tired of working for someone else, making money for someone else. I was always entrepreneurial, had a landscaping lawn cutting business. Glorified as a landscaping business when I was 16. Right. So I was always entrepreneurial and I think people start businesses for that freedom to be able to do what they want, when they want it.

[00:09:07] Not necessarily time freedom. 

[00:09:08] Rounak Sardesai: Sure. 

[00:09:09] Marshall Stern: But just the ability, I guess it is a little bit of time freedom, not having more time, but be able to do what they want. Rather than having to answer to someone else. 

[00:09:16] Rounak Sardesai: Right. 

[00:09:17] Marshall Stern: So I think that's number one. Number two probably is just they don't want to work for someone else.

[00:09:21] Rounak Sardesai: Do you think that's from a freedom perspective, the not wanting to work for somebody else? Or is that like, I can't take orders from somebody else, or, I am so bound to my vision that I cannot align with somebody else's vision? 

[00:09:35] Marshall Stern: That as well, for sure. 

[00:09:36] Rounak Sardesai: Do you think that makes somebody a bad team player?

[00:09:39] Marshall Stern: No. No. If, you as the entrepreneur and the business owner – see, I said, and two different things. If you have people on your team that don't buy into your vision and they're not being a team player, that's a different story. 

[00:09:53] Rounak Sardesai: Right? 

[00:09:54] Marshall Stern: Then they should maybe go either to another company who has that same vision or do their own thing.

[00:09:59] But to answer, finish answering your question, I think it's freedom. I think 1, 2, 3. I think it's time freedom. I think it's financial freedom or the ability – it's the hope. It's the great American dream. And Canadian Dream, North American Dream to be able to just build something. And so I would say it's really the 1, 2, 3 is freedom, freedom, freedom.

[00:10:20] But honestly, when you're working for someone else, I mean, as business owners, entrepreneurs, we are all pretty much salespeople. We are self-employed. When you work for someone else, you're reliant on them, 

[00:10:33] Rounak Sardesai: Right.

[00:10:34] Marshall Stern: And you can only do so much, and they can get rid of you at any time. 

[00:10:38] Rounak Sardesai: That was going to be my next question. So because we have a lot of listeners that are in the early stages of their business, what do you reckon are the three most important skills a business owner must have? 

[00:10:55] Marshall Stern: That's a great question. Leadership. 

[00:10:57] Rounak Sardesai: Okay. Leadership. 

[00:10:59] Marshall Stern: Leadership. Leadership. So one, two, and three are all leadership. Well, I'll expand. I would say belief. 

[00:11:08] Rounak Sardesai: Okay. 

[00:11:09] Marshall Stern: So I would say, I call it a leader's mindset. 

[00:11:11] Rounak Sardesai: Sure. 

[00:11:11] Marshall Stern: So the leader's mindset is one of, I can't do it alone. I need to build a team. 

[00:11:20] Rounak Sardesai: Okay. 

[00:11:20] Marshall Stern: Okay. So I would say that number one, I would say number two, the belief that you and your team, so the belief in yourself, number one, a hundred percent. And the belief in your team, that's also leadership. 

[00:11:34] Rounak Sardesai: Sure. 

[00:11:34] Marshall Stern: If you don't believe in your team, you're not a good leader. Or you have the wrong team, so you need to believe in your team. And the third, take fricking action. 

[00:11:45] Rounak Sardesai: Okay. Like you – so proactivity, 

[00:11:47] Marshall Stern: Proactivity, again, it's leadership, right? Accountability. Okay. But that's all part of sort of leader's mindset. Taking accountability and not blaming the economy. Not blaming, blaming the government, not blaming this. Right. 

[00:12:01] Rounak Sardesai: Very solid answer as well. If I were to answer that, I think I, the only thing I would add is maybe sales to it. I do feel like every business owner needs to have a certain amount of sales skill.

[00:12:16] And I think that also kind of bleeds into the whole leadership mindset, right? Like, if you can't sell what you are offering, then you're not confident enough in the service or in the ability. 

[00:12:30] Marshall Stern: But it all comes back to belief. 

[00:12:31] Rounak Sardesai: Absolutely. Which is why I said it, it's kind of an extension of what you said, yeah.

[00:12:37] Marshall Stern: So I mean, there are a lot, look, this is, and you're in the marketing industry, right? There's a lot of nonsense out there. Especially in the coaching and the marketing. Like it's all – and there are a lot of coaches who are just marketers. They're horrible coaches. They call themselves a coach.

[00:12:52] They have a program that they say, give me $20,000. I'll help you build a seven, eight figure. It used to be six or seven figure. Now it's no, it's eight figure, seven, eight figure. It's going to be a nine figure. I don't even know what that is – you know, in 60 days or whatever. And they've never done it themselves, but they get the money and whatever, and they have a system, right?

[00:13:09] So I think if you believe in what you and your business does, that's sales. It's not about sales. I know what you're saying about the skill. Belief goes a long way. 

[00:13:20] Rounak Sardesai: Yeah. 

[00:13:20] Marshall Stern: Right. And building. You might not be the salesperson for your business if you don't like the cold calling and.

[00:13:26] We can talk about all that kind of stuff and the actual actions if you don't like to take those action steps and, and cold calling people. I'm not saying cold calling is a thing or a good thing. Lead generation, bring someone on your team who could do it, but you are the face of the business. And you need to believe in it and you need to.

[00:13:41] Be very service oriented. This is my belief. This is the Stern Truth. 

[00:13:45] Rounak Sardesai: Walk us through, you know, the 35 years of experience straight from Marshall Stern. I want to understand more about the failures than the –

[00:13:54] Marshall Stern: I was just going to go there.

[00:13:55] Rounak Sardesai -the success. Yeah. 

[00:13:55] Marshall Stern: I'm going to give some good failures. 

[00:13:56] Rounak Sardesai Awesome. 

[00:13:57] Marshall Stern: Okay, so for everyone listening, grab a pad of paper or your laptop or whatever.

[00:14:02] This is the first business lesson I ever learned on building a team. I was 16. Okay. I worked with my grandfather. He had a wholesale business in Winnipeg. I was there for four days. Thank God it was a long weekend. I started with my cousin. It was our grandfather and the place was not air conditioned. It was an old heritage building.

[00:14:18] It was like 35 degrees in Winnipeg. It was so hot in there. It was disgusting. I was alone on two floors of these warehouses, this warehouse. It was my first real job and I hated it. I walked into his office on a Friday, right Thursday. Because Friday was the holiday. Thank God it was a long weekend. And I quit.

[00:14:36] Couldn't do it. I hated it. Hated working for people. I didn't want to be there. It was the summertime. 

[00:14:41] Rounak Sardesai: And what was the company like? What did they do? 

[00:14:43] Marshall Stern: It was like a, back in the day, it was like a wholesale of clothing. So they would actually went, so they would, they would supply clothes, sell clothes to, there was a bunch of Mennonites in Manitoba 

[00:14:52] And Hutterites and villages and whatever. And to stores too. Clothing and, and dry goods, they call them. Next spring I said I'm doing my own thing. This working for someone is not for me. And I started a lawn cutting business. Okay. Blade Lawn Care. If we can't cut it, nobody can.

[00:15:09] Rounak Sardesai: That was pretty good. That is pretty good. 

[00:15:12] Marshall Stern: Yeah. And I, it was myself and I did it all summer. I had like 20 lawns or whatever I had. It was good. I enjoyed it. I got some good, made some good money. I was my boss. Freedom. The next year I started, so I was 18, just turning 18 or just turned 18.

[00:15:28] I don't want to be doing this, but I've had my clients, I had it all set up. I started to do it. I called up one of my friends, I said, David, you're not working right now. Do you want to come work for me? He said, sure. Gave him all my clients. I gave them a cut. I went out to the lake, to the cabin, and I enjoyed my summer while he ran the business.

[00:15:50] And I took less money, but I enjoyed my summer. Call me lazy, call me smart. I don't know. It's for your audience to- 

[00:15:58] Rounak Sardesai: Working on the business, not in the business. Right. 

[00:16:02] Marshall Stern: Right. So that was, that was a success for me. So I was able to enjoy my freedom. Less financial freedom, but more time freedom. So fast forward, went to university, went to college, all that kind of stuff.

[00:16:11] I started, this is a failure. Get ready. I decided in May, so I finished, this was BCIT, or I think it was, and I decided I'm going to start a T-shirt company for the summer. And it was environmental t-shirts, like cartoons with little – I still have each design. I spent a thousand dollars, that was the minimum order, 250 shirts I ordered.

[00:16:33] Okay, this is May the spring. And they each had a different – one of them said, this is really gross. Actually it was, it was a cartoon, a caricature of a guy on a toilet, right? It was funny. And I said, why not recycle all waste? It was all environmentally friendly shirts. Right. 

[00:16:51] Rounak Sardesai: What year is this? This? I was ahead of my game or ahead of the time.

[00:16:55] Marshall Stern: 1991. 

[00:16:58] Rounak Sardesai: You're selling environmental merchandise? 

[00:17:02] Marshall Stern: Yeah. 

[00:17:03] Rounak Sardesai: In 1991. Way before anybody else.

[00:17:05] Marshall Stern: I had an idea. Okay. This is the entrepreneurial part of me I had an idea for, and I never did anything with it. I still think it's awesome. So if someone's out there, go do it. I'm not an engineer. I'm, it's not my thing.

[00:17:18] I had an idea of an add-on to a muffler. This was in 1991. This was 1990. I had an add-on to a muffler, just slide onto the muffler and it would, maybe they have this in California. I don't know. Totally reduce all the emissions. 

[00:17:29] Rounak Sardesai: Okay. 

[00:17:31] Marshall Stern: Maybe they have that. It was just, you just buy it, you slide it on. Never did anything with it.

[00:17:35] Thought I would do this. So it was funny. It was a funny thing and sure, saving the environment. Right. Problem was failures number one. The shirts I had made, well, first of all, I did zero market research and that came to realization quick. The shirts I made were 50/50 poly cotton. The men's small probably would've fit a toddler.

[00:18:04] Like they were really small. I sold one. I went around first to all the stores, all the retail stores on Robson Street here in Vancouver. And I got so many no’s and one lady was very nice and said, just so you know, you missed the buying season by like six months or whatever it was back then. Seven months, the buying seasons in the winter for the spring zero research.

[00:18:28] That was a huge failure, but a learning, big learning for me. I did zero research and I spent a thousand dollars, I lost a thousand dollars minus one shirt that I sold. Ask me where I sold it. 

[00:18:44] Rounak Sardesai: Family? 

[00:18:45] Marshall Stern: No, I set up in Vancouver there's something called Vancouver Swap Meet on Main Street, on Terminal. I mean, it's still there.

[00:18:52] And I set up a booth for two days, cost me $9 a day, and I stood there for the three or four hours that it was open and I sold it to a German tourist, one shirt for $7. And I was so excited. 

[00:19:06] Rounak Sardesai: You think those shirts would sell better today with meme culture so prevalent? 

[00:19:10] Marshall Stern: Possibly. Right? Possibly. 

[00:19:13] Rounak Sardesai: So you were just ahead of your time.

[00:19:14] Marshall Stern: I was ahead of my time, but I did zero research. 

[00:19:16] Rounak Sardesai: Yeah. 

[00:19:16] Marshall Stern: So if I had done it, like I, if I knew my - had done my research, I would've gotten a hundred percent cotton. I would've gone, waited. I would've done the following year, I would've knocked on doors in November or whatever the season was. 

[00:19:27] Rounak Sardesai: I'm actually curious, so you started selling T-shirts that had an environmental message to it. Was the driving force anything to do with how you, how you thought about the environment where we were heading at the time? Or was it just- 

[00:19:42] Marshall Stern: This was me a typical capitalistic, entrepreneurial, I'm being totally honest with you. 

[00:19:48] Rounak Sardesai: No, I, and I appreciate the honesty as well.

[00:19:51] Marshall Stern: We, no one was talking about the environment back then.

[00:19:54] Rounak Sardesai: Right. 

[00:19:54] Marshall Stern: I mean, it was just sort of starting to get out. We weren't composting, you know, California had their issues, so they had the emissions control and whatnot. But it wasn't a thing. 

[00:20:03] Rounak Sardesai: Yeah. 

[00:20:03] Marshall Stern: Yeah. I honestly don't even remember where the idea came from, but I knew I didn't want to work for someone, so I did my own thing.

[00:20:08] Rounak Sardesai: Okay. 

[00:20:09] Marshall Stern: Then I ended up through school, I ended up working at a corporate job. I was in sales, did that for three years, four years, part-time through school and then continued on and that's when I just said, I'm done. I have to stop. I got to do my own thing. So the truth is, I went to school for advertising.

[00:20:26] Okay. You don't know this about me. I wanted to be, I was a huge –  back in the day. Your listeners are probably too young, probably don't even know the show, “30 Something”. It was like the Mad Men of the eighties. 

[00:20:37] Rounak Sardesai: I actually don't know it. 

[00:20:39] Marshall Stern: Yeah, no, but it was all about ads, like Mad Men. It was all about advertising.

[00:20:42] It wasn't as, actually-

[00:20:43] Rounak Sardesai: Was the same theme as Mad Men? Like-

[00:20:45] Marshall Stern: Yeah, but it was set in the eighties as opposed to set in the sixties, fifties. Sixties. But it was an ad agency. Okay. And I fell in love with it and I wanted to be an ad guy. I wanted to, so I applied to all the ad agencies.

[00:20:56] In 1991, when I graduated, no one would hire, we were in a recession. No one was hiring. So I stayed in this other job for a while and then I decided-

[00:21:07] Rounak Sardesai: What were you selling? 

[00:21:09] Marshall Stern: Lottery – it was, I worked for BC Lottery Corporation. So the head office, which was used to be in Vancouver, it was a great organization, great company, loved it there, but I wasn't into climbing the corporate ladder.

[00:21:19] I tried and it just wasn't for me. So I left and I started my own signing graphics company. I thought it was kind of related to advertising, so on and so forth. 

[00:21:27] Rounak Sardesai: Sure. 

[00:21:28] Marshall Stern: But here's another lesson I learned, and this is actually taught by my first employee. It was probably the third or fourth day I opened up, had everything there.

[00:21:37] Zero, like zero clients, zero clients. I pounded the pavement. I used my father-in-law, he went around and handed a flyers. This is Yellow Pages was the whole thing. It's the only way you people knew. It was like print advertising. And the Yellow Pages hadn't come out yet. So I started getting some clients and started to make one of the signs.

[00:21:57] And my employee, Max, said to me, what are you doing? I said, I'm helping. I'm making the sign. He goes, no, no, no. This is what he taught. No. And he'd been in the industry for 25 years and I'll never forget it. He said, you boss, me worker. Me build signs that's, he just talked into like short language, right? Short.

[00:22:14] Me build signs. You sell, you sell signs, me build you, sell me build. And that was the last time I was at that table building a sign. 

[00:22:25] Rounak Sardesai: Wow. Early lesson, eh? 

[00:22:26] Marshall Stern: Early lesson. Yeah. 

[00:22:27] Rounak Sardesai: How old were you when you started the sign business? 

[00:22:31] Marshall Stern: So that was 1994. 

[00:22:33] Rounak Sardesai: That's the year I'm born, by the way. I think you know this about me.

[00:22:37] Marshall Stern: Great. Thanks. Appreciate that. Yeah, so, so yeah, 1994, so I was, how old? 27. 

[00:22:46] Rounak Sardesai: 27. Okay. That's awesome. Yeah, 27 was about the same. I was about the same age when I started the business as well. 

[00:22:54] Marshall Stern: But I did make – there were many mistakes I made there too. 

[00:22:57] Rounak Sardesai: Okay. 

[00:22:58] Marshall Stern: And I'll just make a couple quick ones, but you have to learn and you have to make mistakes to learn from the mistakes in some cases.

[00:23:05] But I will give one piece of advice. I'm going to probably give a lot more, but one for sure. And I'm not an account or bookkeeper. I was fired. I did my books for the first year and my accountant fired me. He says, we're getting you a bookkeeper. Don't be ignorant about the numbers. It's more comfortable in the moment to be ignorant about the numbers.

[00:23:28] And just, it'll be okay. It'll be okay. It'll be okay. But if you think that way, it will not be okay. I can guarantee it. If you're ignorant about the numbers, if you don't think about cash flow, you don't think about when to pay, if you have staff payroll or rent or paying your vendors or whatever, if you just think it'll be okay, look at, don't judge your business by your bank account ever.

[00:23:49] Rounak Sardesai: Yeah. That's actually, that's a very solid, yeah. Way to put it. I feel like there's two types of ignorances when it comes to finances or your books, one kind is where the business owner just does not make entries into the books or you don't have updated books. Just because you're so anxious about looking at it or I don't know, you don't have the time or whatever the excuses are.

[00:24:16] Right. And the other kind is, and I'm guilty of doing this from time to time, you find vanity KPIs to sort of look at your books and go like, yeah, this isn't so great, but I'm doing really good here. Or, yeah, my cashflow isn't great, but at least I'm making profits at the end. Whereas I feel like someone professionally managing and keeping up on your books is a great way to ensure that both of these things don't really happen.

[00:24:44] Because it's important for your business to have a good picture of you know, where you are financially today, as well as where you're going to be in 30 days or six months or a year from now. Yeah, very solid point. 

[00:24:58] Marshall Stern: You know, but here's the, it depends on how serious you are. If you want to build a business, there's a lot of people out there and it's totally fine if you just want to have a part-time business.

[00:25:05] If you have a job, and this is sort of a side hustle or. You have kids and you're just doing this as a side hustle or something, which is totally fine. That's cool. Love it. One of my clients, actually in one of my podcast episodes called, referred to, she wants to become a mature business owner, and I love that.

[00:25:21] If you want to be a mature business owner, a serious business owner, build a serious business, you cannot ignore the numbers. And so you need to surround yourself with people who can help you with that. And trust me, I know this from my own experience. You look at bank accounts, it's like, oh, I have $10,000 in my bank account, or I have $10,000 in my line of credit available.

[00:25:44] Okay. What you forgot – okay. For payroll, let's say what you forgot is here in Canada, even in the US I have taxes, remittance that's coming out on a certain date. I have payroll remittance coming out on a certain date. And then all of a sudden, holy crap, it's out. And you look at your bank account and you can't make payroll.

[00:26:04] Because sometimes with payroll, if you don't make payroll. It's not good. Employees don't like that. But what's worse, honestly, is when you don't pay your taxes, you are not only penalized, like it's not good for your credit. You have to pay taxes. 

[00:26:20] Rounak Sardesai: You're 27. You've started your sign company. Now, how long does it take you to actually start to enjoy the business as such? 

[00:26:29] And by that I mean it can be different for different people, right? Like enjoyment for my first positive feeling from the business was landing my first client. That was one major milestone for me. And then I think the end of our first financial year, we had like a revenue mark of, I believe, 60,000 Canadian dollars.

[00:26:49] At the time when I started my business, I was making about $70,000at a corporate job. And I equaled that amount in revenue at my business. So that was a big deal for me. How was the journey over the first five years or so? 

[00:27:03] Marshall Stern: I remember the first month I did 10,000. 

[00:27:05] Rounak Sardesai: Okay. And at the time, 10,000 was a lot.

[00:27:08] Marshall Stern: So I got the systems, which I never used. I hardly used them. This is the entrepreneur in me. I always was pushing against what I was told to do. 

[00:27:16] Rounak Sardesai: Right. 

[00:27:17] Marshall Stern: The systems that they put in place, 10,000 was a lot for a new location. And that was sort of, so when I did that and I knew what my breakeven point was and if I could do that consistently.

[00:27:26] That was the first one. Landing jobs, just big projects. Like we used to have the Molson Indie here in Vancouver. 

[00:27:33] Rounak Sardesai: Yes. 

[00:27:33] Marshall Stern: So I didn't do all of it, but I did one small part of it, which was massive for me. It was like three months of work. I had one, my production up until I sold, which was two years ago.

[00:27:46] He was with me for 26 years. 

[00:27:48] Rounak Sardesai: Wow. 

[00:27:48] Marshall Stern: One of my production guys, designers, was with me for 17 years. Another person for 15 years. I don’t know if I'm really, I'm sort of going on a side of this, but this is, these are all the highlights, just building a team. It was a serious business. My graphic designer, my lead guy, during the Olympics, like 2010 leading up to it for the month leading up to it, slept at the shop.

[00:28:09] Because he lived in Abbotsford and my office was in Yaletown. He had a little cot, a little bed, and he would sleep at the shop and he'd do the little fake shower with his deodorant or whatever. Not for a month straight. He'd go home on the weekends, but like seriously, many days during the week instead of the commute, he would just sleep there because we were so busy.

[00:28:26] He got so much overtime. We needed it. 

[00:28:28] Rounak Sardesai: Yeah. 

[00:28:29] Marshall Stern: But it was exciting. It was an exciting time. Landing those big jobs was awesome. 

[00:28:34] Rounak Sardesai: When you first hired these team members back in 95, 96, whenever you first did you actually know that they would stick around for, 17 years, 25 years. 

[00:28:48] Marshall Stern: No, I wasn't like,

[00:28:49] Rounak Sardesai: What was the mentality going into that hiring process?

[00:28:53] Marshall Stern: Okay. We're being honest. I had a five year plan. 

[00:28:55] Rounak Sardesai: Right. 

[00:28:56] Marshall Stern: That was my five year plan for this business. I was going to start it, build it, sell it, do something else. 

[00:29:02] Rounak Sardesai: Okay. 

[00:29:03] Marshall Stern: I was there for 29 years, so no, I didn't think that they were going to be with me for that. I didn't think I was going to be with me there for that long.

[00:29:09] Rounak Sardesai: Okay. But do you reckon it's a good idea? To get into business with a five year plan even today? 

[00:29:17] Marshall Stern: That's a great question. That brings up the whole idea of a business plan. So I like a three year plan. Okay. It depends on where you're at in life too. Like a five year plan for someone at my age. I'm kidding.

[00:29:29] No, but yeah, five years, who knows what. But it is true. Like five years out for you is different than five years out for me. I mean, five years is to three years. Not a huge difference. I remember taking a program years ago, a coaching program, a really good one. And they wanted you to have a 20 year, what they call it, big hairy, audacious goal.

[00:29:48] Rounak Sardesai: Okay. 

[00:29:49] Marshall Stern: And plan. 

[00:29:50] Rounak Sardesai: Was this before COVID or after COVID? 

[00:29:51] Marshall Stern: This is way before.

[00:29:53] Rounak Sardesai: This is before COVID. That makes sense. Yeah. 

[00:29:55] Marshall Stern: But 20 years, ridiculous for your business. Okay. For your life for sure. 

[00:29:59] Rounak Sardesai: Right. 

[00:30:00] Marshall Stern: Okay. But for your business 20 years, I like a three year plan. But let's talk about business plan. If you – you need a plan, unless you want to go for funding.

[00:30:10] You don't need a nicely bound, you know, you know, fancy business plan with projections and with all the stuff that's just going to sit on your computer and collect dust or on your bookshelf and collect dust. You need a plan that you're going to implement and that you're going to review consistently. Otherwise, there's no point.

[00:30:29] Rounak Sardesai: So Coala Studio has been in existence for five and a half years now. When we first started out, we were offering a set of services. Both project and retailer. And if I were to compare what we are today versus what we were five and a half years ago, there's obviously a lot of difference, right? And there's been constant evolution over time.

[00:30:52] How often do you reckon your people you work with or entrepreneurs that you talk to, how often do you think they review this business plan that they'd originally created? And how often is it tweaked an in what direction and what it impacts that direction that they take the most? 

[00:31:12] Marshall Stern: For those who do have a plan, I don't think it's reviewed at all.

[00:31:17] If they end up working with someone like myself or another coach, then yes, it'll be reviewed. But again, it's all about the more complicated anything is, the less likely you will be to take any action, with it. It could just simply be a one page. Look, spreadsheets are different. Okay. Like financial projections.

[00:31:38] That's totally different. I'm all like a hundred percent. You need to have something, but you need to know, like, I go back to the what, like what do you want in three years? Completely. Okay. Just come up with the vision of where you want, not just your business, but your life and craft. Build a business that serves your life.

[00:31:55] That's what I believe. Okay. Some people can go and buy a, let's say a junk removal company. It's not a sexy industry. They just want to become the biggest junk removal company in North America or in the world. Okay, that's great. And if you read his book, WTF, great book, it's all about him building a team.

[00:32:14] And he couldn't do it alone. 

[00:32:17] Rounak Sardesai: Nowhere close to where, yeah. He wouldn't be anywhere close without a team. 

[00:32:20] Marshall Stern: It’s all about the team. But it's about the vision and bringing people on your team who buy your, buy into your vision, business plan, whatever it is. It's always, if it's five years or three years.

[00:32:29] In one year you should revisit it more frequently, but in one year it's now out, you move it out another year. So it's always that three years you always have to be navigating. And that's leadership. Always be prepared. We know things happen and things will happen sometimes that we're not expecting.

[00:32:45] The more you can expect and predict the better, but no one would've predicted the pandemic. Quick story, if I may. 

[00:32:51] Rounak Sardesai: Of course. 

[00:32:52] Marshall Stern: You know, it doesn't have to be your passion, but be passionate about what, what you do. So I was bored. In my business, 2008, 2009. Yes, everything down south went south. The crash of 2008 didn't really affect us in Canada that much.

[00:33:09] My business, I didn't see it that much. I started to see it after the Olympics. Right, because we had sort of a false sense of security here in, in British Columbia, at least, with the Olympics. So once February 12th, 2010 happened, which was the opening ceremonies. That was it. Like we were at our peak and then it was, like, quiet.

[00:33:29] So quiet. Not just here, but like everywhere. You know, once the Olympics were over, restaurants, everyone for a while it was really quiet and the economy started to suffer. We started to feel the 2008 anyways. So after a few years, go make it short. After a few years I thought I need to pivot, navigate, change.

[00:33:47] My sign company. We were just doing, we were all things to everyone. Businesses. We were always dealing primarily 99% of the time with businesses and I decided I'm going to be the Brian Scudamore and have this new vision change everything. And I had my own little painted picture. My business was no longer going to be this known for this for everything.

[00:34:06] It was now going to be known because I left the franchise back in 2005. And I went out on my own. 

[00:34:12] Rounak Sardesai: Right. 

[00:34:13] Marshall Stern: Okay. So, because I was a rebel, although I was, my sales were like number one in Canada at the time. They probably were happy I left. I decided I wanted to become known - our company was going to be known for.

[00:34:23] Interior, like environments, environmental signage. Sure. Those office interiors. Wall murals. Wall wraps. Privacy film. I found that sexy. I found that so exciting. And it just energized me. 

[00:34:37] Rounak Sardesai: I just want to rewind for a second. You found that sexy. 

[00:34:40] Marshall Stern: It was sexy. It was as that's what was in the industry. I know.

[00:34:44] Rounak Sardesai: And I feel that's really important. If you're in business, you're doing something, you need to be attracted to it. Like, even if you're not super passionate about it. When you go out and, you know, you tell people about it, I feel like there should be the sense of pride that that comes from within.

[00:34:59] Like, hey man, this is what I do and I really like it.

[00:35:02] Marshall Stern: What we do is sexy. 

[00:35:03] Rounak Sardesai: Yeah, exactly. Right. 

[00:35:04] Marshall Stern: Yeah. Yeah. So I think everyone has to have their own version of sexy. Right. At least they feel it. Right. Because a lot of the stuff we were doing – our number one client, well we did a lot in the film industry, which is also sexy.

[00:35:16] Rounak Sardesai: Yeah. 

[00:35:16] Marshall Stern: Right. It wasn't sexy work, but it was exciting. We did all the slates. So for the camera department. So, you know the, right. Take one, take two. We became known. That was one thing we became known in, in all of Vancouver. We were the ones who designed these really cool graphics for them.

[00:35:34] Okay. So it wasn't just a block on white or whatever. So we did all 90% of the productions TV and film that came through Vancouver, where British Columbia we did. It wasn't a big money maker, but it was exciting, right. And the team loved it. But most of the other stuff we did was just basic, like property managers were number one for us.

[00:35:51] So we did like parking signs, right? Like this morning where I parked parking, park here, reserve. sure, whatever. All that kind of stuff. Nothing exciting about it, nothing sexy. So I decided, wanted to get away from that and they were our biggest repeat, biggest revenue client as well. All the property managers, we were like one of the, we dealt with a lot of the big firms.

[00:36:14] In the city and, we want to become known now for office interiors, right? I connected, I did a campaign lead gen. I did it myself with interior designers, commercial interior designers. We went hard on it. I had a whole brochure made up. Office murals, you know, mantras on the walls, privacy film, all that kind of stuff.

[00:36:34] We were going to get rid of property managers. Eventually and focus on this and we're going to – I had plans to redesign our showroom and bring in in samples and everything. It was going to be big. It was going to be beautiful. It excited me. It was sexy. That was 2019 when I implemented everything. 

[00:36:53] Rounak Sardesai: Wow. 

[00:36:56] Marshall Stern: We know what happened.

[00:36:58] 2020 comes along. Thank God I didn't get rid of my property managers. Because that entire industry that I was going after that was so sexy was gone. 

[00:37:10] Rounak Sardesai: Yep. 

[00:37:12] Marshall Stern: My property managers, that's when I fell in love with my business again. I thought I fell in love with the before with the vision of the sexiness of all this stuff.

[00:37:22] I fell in love with it again when the pandemic happened and all of a sudden our property managers on the residential side, commercial know 'cause they were shut down at the beginning. They needed our help. They needed to protect the lobbies. They need the plexiglass stuff. They need decos all over the place on the elevator.

[00:37:40] Stay six, you know, two people per elevator, whatever it was, or three people, six feet apart. 

[00:37:45] Rounak Sardesai: Lots of opportunity for signage and we went and stickers, yeah.

[00:37:48] Marshall Stern: we went from our worst month ever in, at that point, almost 20 years, 17 years or whatever it was, 19 years. Like April was our worst month ever. April, 2020, to our best month ever. Just like that overnight. And then it went back to kind of normal, somewhat normalcy after that. What I was passionate about it because we were actually really saving lives. Right. We weren't doctors. We weren't, but we were helping. Contributing. We were absolutely. And we were a service that had to be open. 

[00:38:21] Rounak Sardesai: Yep. 

[00:38:21] Marshall Stern: So just be prepared to navigate and pivot quickly. Because you just don't know. Right. And if you're, like some people you saw you, there were like liquor spirit companies that were- 

[00:38:34] Rounak Sardesai: Yeah. With sanitizers. 

[00:38:36] Marshall Stern: Sanitizers

[00:38:37] Rounak Sardesai: Sanitizers and wipes. Yeah. You mentioned something very interesting earlier, and, and like, just for context, one of the reasons that, you know, I've always enjoyed working with you and having a conversation with you is because unlike a lot of coaches out there, or just in general, unlike a lot of people out there, you value family and personal life just as much as you do business, right?

[00:39:04] The ups and downs of business, eventually in some way, form or the other, trickle down into, into my personal life as well. Right. You mentioned worst month in business financially after a period of 20 years. Right? How does one stay sane in a period like that? 

[00:39:24] Marshall Stern: In all honesty, that worst month, I'll go back to other worst months.

[00:39:31] Because that worst month ever, in all of the 29 years in my, that business, that was probably April, 2020 was probably my calmest month ever. It's weird. March 13th or whatever it was to mid-April, the world was shut down. What could we do now? Now, I just want to go. Somewhere else for a second. Because this is also something I want people to take from this.

[00:39:52] Take care of your people, your employees, take care of, and of course your significant other. Take care of your people. So the world shut down, businesses shut down. And my wife, I love her, said, you have to let everyone go. Everyone was doing that. You have to. You can't pay them. You have to let them go.

[00:40:14] Because we have no idea what's going to go on. I kept saying two weeks. That's what the health minister says. Two weeks. Remember the time. It'll be two weeks. It'll be two weeks. It'll be two weeks. We'll see. Well, in two weeks I knew something was coming on. The wage subsidy eventually. 

[00:40:28] Rounak Sardesai: Yeah. 

[00:40:29] Marshall Stern: I couldn't let my people go.

[00:40:32] They'd been with me for so long. They had families. They were loyal to me. I needed to be loyal to them. I knew it was going to get better. This was temporary. So I stuck with it. We didn't shut down ever, and then we basically, we did like our entire showroom, we designed it, whatever. I kept them busy and then it opened.

[00:40:52] Everything opened up again, 

[00:40:54] Rounak Sardesai: right? 

[00:40:55] Marshall Stern: In fact, I'll take it one step further. This is where you, as the leader of your business needs, need to really think down the road. Into the vision. Short term. Even like short term, meaning six months, a year, a year back, I was looking for someone upfront, an in-house sales person, right?

[00:41:11] Because my person had left, gone back to school. I couldn't find anyone with experience. I didn't want to train someone from start to finish. It was too much, too many things to learn. I want someone with experience. Couldn't find anyone. So I just did double work at the time. Pandemic happened, fine. 

[00:41:26] In August, actually, I got an application from this one person. She had experience. She was laid off because of COVID. Just like a lot of companies. I brought her in for an interview and I hired her. I didn't need her. At the time, sales were probably 50% of what they normally were, but I knew things were going to turn around. 

[00:41:46] So I took a leap of faith. Let's be real. This business thing is hard. So you need to do your best, whether it's with your friends or your significant other, or kids and or all of the above, your family. Do your best to try to not bring it home with you, but if you have a bad month or you're in financial difficulty, bring someone to bring someone to help you because your significant other or friends might not be.

[00:42:17] Rounak Sardesai: Yeah. 

[00:42:18] Marshall Stern: It's lonely. 

[00:42:19] Rounak Sardesai: It definitely is lonely. 

[00:42:20] Marshall Stern: So that's why I run groups. I run coaching groups, group coaching programs. I run like once a month, just a networking thing, which is free. Just hang around with other entrepreneurs, people who are ideally, people who are maybe one step ahead of you, right? Or similar.

[00:42:36] And you can just talk and that they get it and they might be able to give you some advice. My wife didn't get it. She thought I – she started working in my company later on, after about 20 years of me, right. Being in the business. Right? Because she had her own career and then we, she had kids. Before that, she always thought that I was like this pushover of a boss.

[00:42:58] She came from the banking world where it's like, this, this, this very, they don't do their job, they're gone. Right. Strict, very strict. Structure. Policy, policy, policy. And I was all, we were a family. My team. We were a family. So connect with your people. Okay? Surround yourself with people who can support you.

[00:43:21] It's mindset. It’s not easy. It's not easy. I had shitty months early on. I had people that didn't pay me. Here's another thing, another tip, like for business owners with the whole email, because everything is now, everything's at our fingertips. It's so easy just to respond. It's so easy to, client, to our, to a prospect, to an employee.

[00:43:44] It's so easy. Just message back, message back, message back. And then you, your focus is taken away from what you're actually really trying to do. 

[00:43:51] Rounak Sardesai: Yeah. 

[00:43:51] Marshall Stern: So block the time for that kind, that kind of work. Don't be like a slave. Don't treat your text box or inbox as your agenda. 

[00:44:01] Rounak Sardesai: Correct. 

[00:44:02] Marshall Stern: It's someone else's agenda.

[00:44:04] Rounak Sardesai: Yep. Speaking of habits, what are some of the good habits that make an entrepreneur or business owner do better than the average lot? 

[00:44:18] Marshall Stern: Yeah, you can talk about like the 5:00 AM club. Okay. That's it. Get up. 5:00 AM. Exercise, journal, exercise, all that kind of stuff. Meditate. Here is the thing. It's going to be different for everyone. And that's the problem with most programs out there. Most books out there, they teach you one way.

[00:44:40] Okay. Discipline. It does take discipline, but what discipline, what discipline is for you might be a little bit different for me. Okay? So you might be a late night person. I might be a morning person. So why, if you're a late night person, why should you follow the 5:00 AM club rule?

[00:44:59] So I would say habit wise, do what works for you. Number one, proactive work, what I call the on it work. What's really going to move the needle for your business? Get it done. That's a priority. Get it done in your most focused hour. I would say the habits consistency, number one. Good. The right consistency.

[00:45:23] But being intentional. So being intentional on the right actions and being consistent. So I would say like take consistent daily action towards what you say you want. You know, play a sport, go hiking, but be consistent with all of it. And work on your mindset for people who have kids, young kids, not, not necessarily older, but like.

[00:45:47] Yeah. Young kids, like under 10, under 12. 

[00:45:49] Rounak Sardesai: They need your attention all the time. 

[00:45:51] Marshall Stern: They're going to be needing your attention. It's like having a dog, right? They're going to, the dog's going to become wanting to go for a walk, wanting go outside. Kids want to play, especially summertime. 

[00:45:58] Rounak Sardesai: Right? 

[00:45:59] Marshall Stern: Kids are going to want your attention more.

[00:46:00] So it's all about doing what works for you and being consistent. And that's really, I would say that's it. I mean, one system doesn't work for everyone, right? And the problem is with all these online experts is they make you feel like shit. When you love what you do, here's the problem. This is really the challenge.

[00:46:19] I don't think of it as work. Yeah. So my wife's always saying, you're working so much, you're working so much. 

[00:46:23] Rounak Sardesai: But it doesn't, I like what I'm doing. 

[00:46:26] Marshall Stern: If I could talk to people all day long, I would, I'm usually told by the people around me, if I'm, if I am starting to burn out, they could see it.

[00:46:35] Right. They could see it in my mood. I remember taking my son, he was late for baseball practice. Once it was baseball practice. He was 10 years old. 10 years old baseball practice wasn't a game and he was late. And my wife says, I have anxiety about being late. This wasn't me being late. It was him, I guess.

[00:46:52] So I guess I have it. It was nuts and it was practice and I had to pull over and I had to like, like I probably still had, I probably like made a dent in my steering wheel like I and my son was with me and he all, then I saw how it affected him. It was a low point, like I had to pull over and say like, what's my problem?

[00:47:11] It's just a practice. But I wouldn't have gotten to that point if I had seen the signs and I had sort of meditated, right? Taken a break. I was getting burnt out at the time. I mean, this is 10 years ago. I have to constantly work at it. 

[00:47:26] Rounak Sardesai: I was actually just telling my wife this yesterday. She actually sat me down, after dinner and she's like, Hey, I want to talk to you.

[00:47:34] And, she actually asked me this, this really nice question and she's like, you know, when I first met you. You were somebody, like one of the things that attracted me towards you the most was the fact that you keep your surroundings like super clean. Like you were one of the only guys I know who cares about how his apartment looks.

[00:47:55] I just like my surroundings clean, and even today that's how it is. But off late, like about a month or so. I really haven't had the time to focus on any of these things, and it's, it's not that I don't want to, it's just that the ebbs and flows of business have kept me occupied to a degree where everything else, including my surroundings, have become secondary to me at this point.

[00:48:22] And she's arguing on, she's like, I'm just checking in, is everything okay in your life? Because I can start to see that the one thing that you care about so much isn't really happening. So I guess other people do see the stress or the anxiety kind of building up in words, actions, or habits around you.

[00:48:47] Marshall Stern: Yeah. If you're showing up out of character, out of your normal character, for sure. For sure. And you have to – the key is to listen to it. I remember when I started coaching, it was a through, it was a leadership program, leadership coaching program. I started to forget about my other business. I stopped being a leader for that and I stopped being a leader for my family.

[00:49:08] I was so involved in what I was doing. I loved it so much that I remember several occasions my wife said to me, you, I remember back in the day, you know, to call yourself a leadership coach and yet you, you don't seem to be like, leading this family. In some form. She mentioned that and I said, what are you talking about?

[00:49:29] I don't know what you're talking about. Because you're stuck in your thing. Right. And then after a while it's like, okay, I started to see it, but I didn't want to listen at the time because love is blind. So I fell in love with this other thing. I was having an affair with my leadership coaching business and I forgot what was really important.

[00:49:46] Because that was my, the new thing and that was the shiny object. 

[00:49:50] Rounak Sardesai: There's so many coaches out there, right? Like on the internet. I'm going to, I don't know if I can name them, but sure. Dan Locke's, one of them. How do you compare to someone like a Dan Locke and how are you different and why would someone choose to work with you as opposed to working with someone, you know, someone who's like pitching a seven to eight figure system, right? As such. 

[00:50:16] Marshall Stern: Yeah. There's laws Dan Locke, there's Grant Cardone, 10 x Your Business, right? Tony Robbins, 

[00:50:22] Rounak Sardesai: Andy Elliot. 

[00:50:23] Marshall Stern: They're all there, right? There's tons, there's millions. There's like thousands, hundreds of thousands of coaches. What I would say is, first of all, you're not going to work with them.

[00:50:33] That's the first thing. You're not working with them. It was a 30 day program, so about 10 years ago, eight years ago – because coaches – if you're going to coach, you have to have a coach. 

[00:50:43] Rounak Sardesai: Right. 

[00:50:44] Marshall Stern: Right. Not all the time, but you need a coach. So I hired a Tony Robbins coach, they gave me someone, she was nice. I let her go after six months.

[00:50:56] Rounak Sardesai: Yep. 

[00:50:57] Marshall Stern: Because it was Tony Robbins in a disguise. And I needed someone who I could relate to and who could relate to me. And it was always like, well, Tony says this. Tony says that. Tony says this. Tony says that you need to buy his program, this, whatever. It was very scripted and every, every session just opened up with, she would ask me how I'm doing.

[00:51:23] I'm saying, fine. I'd ask her how she was doing and she would go every time she would say, I am super duper fantastic. And one day I just got so fed up. I said, really? She goes, what do you mean? What? And I said, are you really super, super fantastic? And she didn't know what to say. Probably completely change all of our businesses and ourselves.

[00:51:42] Him himself. If you can afford to have Tony Robbins as a coach, but we can't, not all of us can. I meet my clients where they're at. Everyone's different. Everyone has different challenges. If I'm not a fit for someone and they're not a, they might not be a fit for me, it has to go both ways. And there has to be this relationship, there has to be something there because it's not like, take my course, you'll be fine.

[00:52:07] This is all, this is like real time. This is you and me going through a journey to get you to, on a path to where you want to get to. There are a lot of amazing coaches out there, so interview coaches, if you're looking for one, interview them, talk to them, see what's the right fit. And not one system fits all.

[00:52:25] So I don't have a system. I have a framework. 

[00:52:28] Rounak Sardesai: That's pretty solid. 

[00:52:30] Marshall Stern: Yeah. I have a methodology. Yeah, I have a way of, right? But the way I might coach you, it's similar to the way I coach someone else, but in different ways. In different steps. And each time something else comes up that's differently, we might go different.

[00:52:44] We might go in a different place. 

[00:52:45] Rounak Sardesai: Thank you so much for being here today and, this was awesome, man. That's what I've got. 

[00:52:53] Marshall Stern: No, I appreciate it. No, this is, I could keep going but I know time's up. So, no, thank you so much. I appreciate it. But I appreciate you. 

[00:53:00] Rounak Sardesai: Same here.

[00:53:04] Marshall Stern: Thank you so much for tuning in to the Stern Truth. If you found today's episode helpful, we would love to hear from you. Please like, share and leave us a review. Also, if you'd like to be a guest in the upcoming episode or join us in one of our Moment Accountability Group sessions, simply email me to marshall@marshallstern.net.

[00:53:24] That's marshall@marshallstern.net. And don't forget to hit the subscribe button, so never miss an episode. Until next time, keep pushing forward and leading with confidence.